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While I'm unaware of these two extremely well known historical incidents having ever been systematically compared before, I think you'll find that the two have some remarkable similarities. In both the case of Joan of Arc, and the Salem Witch Trials, we have adolescent girls manipulating, and being manipulated, by powerful men, to achieve their own objectives, for their own reasons. In both cases, we hear strident cries of "witchcraft". Although Joan of Arc was canonized as a Saint by the Pope during the Babylonian captivity, actually, it's quite clear that she was having a great deal of fun lording it over all the powerful warlords in play, during her period of ascendancy, just like the girls in Salem were loving every second of dominating the community of Salem, and, ultimately, all of New England society, at all levels.
https://salem.lib.virginia.edu/images/mattwitch1.jpg
I think a significant point here is simply the fact that adolescent girls could have such massive, if temporary effect on society, because that's only possible if society is, or is becoming, centralized to a high degree. And, clearly this was the case in both New England and the time of the Witch Trials, and in France when Joan of Arc played her particular role. These young girls tapped into the increasing ability to gather a mass audience and influence it quickly, in their developing societies, to such an extent, that everyone was taken off guard, and surprised, and astonished. And, these facts presage the ultimate revolutions that overturned their respective societies in the coming decades -- both the French, and the Americans, respectively throwing off the yoke of the English, because of centralization of power locally, to repel the English.
Now, the difference here, is that Joan of Arc represented herself as an agent of God, and was burned as a witch, and ultimately became a Saint, while the girls in Salem falsely condemned others as witches, and these Salem girls themselves went on to leave fairly uneventful lives following their brief period of stardom. Joan was a religious girl who had seen the damage the English were doing in her country, who had seen family members killed by them. She convinced herself she was a chosen prophet and savior of her people, probably hormonally driven to some extent. She fought and suffered for her people, achieved some brilliant victories, suffered and survived serious injuries, only to be captured by the English, and done cruelly to death by them. However, she could have been ransomed by the French King, who offered nothing for her. This may have been a mistake. This gave the English the opportunity to discredit the King's instrument in a trial for heresy. In any case, the power games involved here were of a very high order.
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/f2/67/c0/f267c0b69840ffd081706bc78527ced5.jpg
The Salem witch trials more reveal the growing independence and power of the colony of Massachusetts, its government structures, and their ability and facility to influence the people, in response to popular demands. This, of course, grew greater and greater with the coming decades, even if trials for witchcraft were discredited.
Have you ever wondered if there WAS witchcraft being practiced and this was just a way to bury it?
What is witchcraft? There are modern witches, who claim to practice witchcraft. Generally, I find they're engaging in a combination of pop psychology with herbal remedies. I suspect in the past, a "witch" was simply anyone who did anything you didn't like, or, who you thought might be responsible for your problems in some way.
Well, one real world example (of many) is South Korea being run by a cult of witches engaged in fairy goddess worship.
So, if your view is as you describe, then you are perhaps unaware of the groups that operate in secrecy and actually engage in rituals, spells and covert forms of power over others.
Another example if the Process Church of the Final Judgment, which incorporate as much black magic into their operations as possible; from Crowley's works to voodoo cults, they embraced it all and eventually began forming animal friendly NGOs.
I can go on and on. Point being, we have repeatedly seen cults, like NXIVM, sneak their way into political power. Secret societies. Etc. Rituals. Mind Control. Black Magic.
Occult merely means hidden. But there are secret occult groups that trade in covert power.
So, it is a good psy op for their benefit if as many people as possible believe as you do... "there is no such thing. It's debunked."
I believe in "witchcraft", I just think it's rather simpler, less powerful, and more comprehensible than witches themselves seem to think.
Hillary Clinton and her spirit cooker cohorts considers themselves witches.
They embrace what others consider evil and seek to enslave people and organizations.
https://www.thecut.com/2018/04/last-night-the-wing-welcomed-hillary-clinton-into-the-coven.html
So, these secret groups are not without consequence. You throw in the pedophile rings and spirit cooking, and now your witches are so benign, are they?
People can be mean. I didn't say witches are always benign. Just that they're not necessarily terribly effective. I'm skeptical of their "powers" being much greater than anyone else's.
The secrecy is the power, for the most part.
Potions work. LSD, Ecstasy, Cocaine, Devil's Breath, etc.
Just because scientifically sound methods of control work in a magical context doesn't make it any less effective.
Spelling out words and repeating them everywhere works as NLP. Whether or not the originator believes in magic or not is irrelevant.
Well, OK. I'm not saying that "witches" might not have some particular tricks that most people don't employ. Just that I'm not convinced they're any more effective, or really that different from what anyone else might do. Put it another way, I think the "power" of witches is somewhat overrated, particularly by witches themselves. Although, I'm sure every witch has her day!
My contention is that literal witches have been proven to be ruling several countries that we know about. Given the containment efforts, it would not be surprising to learn there were more than the public was aware of.
I would say that, especially hundreds of years ago, people would have been relatively justified in killing actual witches taking control of local and regional governments via covert means.
OK. You can call Hillary Clinton a "witch" if you want. But, what exactly do witches do differently from anyone else? You could certainly call Joan of Arc a witch, she seemed to possess extraordinary powers of social manipulation. So, does that make Donald Trump a "witch"? Or, perhaps Bill Clinton as well? Maybe Barack Obama? Are they all witches?
You haven't really defined what a 'witch" is, as far as I can tell.
I didn't necessarily have a need to define a witch, other than to point out your own definition was perhaps a bit myopic or too narrow.
Without being a black and white thinker, and engaging in a little thought experiment to form the right frame: I'm not just posing the question who the “witches” are, but how we define what a political witch actually is, and what that means for power, perception, and symbolism.
🧙♀️
Old ideas of magic have evolved and go beyond fairy tales or folk magick. The modern “witch” as a politico-symbolic archetype — would be along the lines of someone who:
🧛♂️ Male Equivalent?
While “witch” is gendered historically, male equivalents have often been labeled differently, such as:
So the masculine archetype is often less demonized and more mystified, while the female is more often accused, vilified, or feared.
Is Trump a "witch" or warlock in this sense? Yes, absolutely. He uses coded language, secret hand symbols and wields covert influence of many types. Does he believe in black magic? Sure. The modern equivalent.
🔥 Modern or Recent Figures
🏛️ Historical Figures
🧠 A Witch Is…
If we define a “witch” in the political arena as:
…then many public figures play the role of the witch, even if they're not literally casting spells; though they are "spelling" out rules, policy and courses of action that leverage power into the hands of fewer and fewer people.
Personally, women in political power who literally believe in black magic are witches. That is a good enough definition for me. There are many women who fit this bill in modern politics.
If we think of men, similarly, "devil worshipper" works fine for me. Men in politics who believe in black magic occultism and use these techniques... as many tactics employed by the CIA and other intelligence and counter intelligences groups... they are devil worshippers. To me.
If you want to split hairs, you can split hairs, but what these people do is EVIL.
OK. In that case, a "witch" is simply anyone who has skills and abilities not everyone possesses, as far as I understand you. So, obviously, those kinds of people would tend to take control of governments. I don't really see this as a very significant point though. Calling them "witches" instead of skilled politicians, doesn't seem to add much to our understanding. It just sounds like name calling.
How would you define a 'real' witch?
Anyone who chooses to call themselves "a witch", and chooses to say they are engaging in "witchcraft". I think the concept is extremely vague, and flexible.
Is there a difference between a mall-goth who just ordered a Wiccan spell-book from Amazon, and, say, Marina Abramović, or are they both just witches in your book?
They're both just witches, in my book.
Fair enough
Do you suspect the Biblical/Medieval Witchcraft differed a lot from our modern day definition?
I know several modern day "witches", and as much as I dislike their pale affect and Hot-Topic demeanor, I have never subjected them to any trials-by-fire just because I think they are fat.
Were our relatively recent ancestors that barbaric, they just kill the ugly goth girls in the village?
[Edit: Really enjoyed reading your post regardless, good write-up]
Given how barbaric we still are, I strongly suspect that our relatively recent ancestors would have killed anyone who looked at them the wrong way, a lot of people still do. The term "witch hunt" is still in current use, for good reason.